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Outcomes by College Major
#1
I found a good report from the Federal Reserve Bank of New York.

Majors with unemployment rates at or above 5%

Mass Media 7.8%
Liberal Arts 6.7%
Anthropology 6.6%
Miscellaneous Technologies 6.4%
Philosophy 6.2%
Construction Services 6.1%
Mathematics 5.8%
Nutrition Sciences 5.8%
Ethnic Studies 5.7%
Fine Arts 5.6%
Engineering Technologies 5.3%
Earth Sciences 5.3%
English Language 5.3%
Physics 5.3%
Information Systems and Management 5.0%
General Engineering 5.0%
Geography 5.0%

Majors with underemployment rates at or above 50%

Criminal Justice 73.2%
Performing Arts 65.7%
Leisure and Hospitality 63.0%
Public Policy and Law 62.8%
Business Management 59.6%
Anthropology 59.1%
Liberal Arts 58.4%
Fine Arts 58.4%
Miscellaneous Technologies 58.0%
Animal and Plant Sciences 57.4%
Art History 56.5%
General Business 56.4%
Sociology 56.0%
Mass Media 55.2%
Agriculture 53.9%
History 53.1%
Communications 53.0%
Marketing 52.7%
General Social Sciences 52.3%
Political Science 51.5%
Philosophy 50.9%
Medical Technicians 50.9%
English Language 50.6%
Ethnic Studies 50.1%

At the beginning of 2018, the median wage for those with high school diplomas was $28,000. The median wage for those with bachelor's degrees was $44,000. These are the majors that have mid-career salaries below $44,000.

Early Childhood Education $41,000
Elementary Education $43,000

https://www.newyorkfed.org/research/college-labor-market/college-labor-market_compare-majors.html
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#2
these are always fun.

I have a high school friend I bump into from time to time - crazy smart. Is *literally* a rocket scientist. Last time I bumped into him, he left his job and was selling scale drawings/blueprints of rocket models online and living in the woods with cats. Which is to say, our degree is only a piece of the puzzle of life - one tiny piece.

EDIT to add- this reminded me to look him up, I have no doubt he loves his life.
Jennifer
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MS Applied Nutrition, 2014 Canisius College, NY
Premed/Prenursing Sciences, 2011 Ocean County College, NJ
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#3
I think sometimes about a letter from the president to parents of prospective students that used to be up on the website of Berklee College of Music, the college of contemporary music where courses include Creating Tracks for Hip-Hop Songs and Advanced Stylistic Comping – Roots/Rock.

The bit about "career insurance," emphasis mine, is like what Jennifer's friend has found.

Roger H. Brown Wrote:Understandably, many parents have anxieties about their children aspiring to have a career in music. I'm reminded of the Willie Nelson lyric, "Mamas don't let your babies grow up to be cowboys. Don't let them pick guitars and drive them old trucks, let them be doctors and lawyers and such." Aspirations for careers in music might be right next to cowboys in generating parental anxiety. I believe the music industry, though no cakewalk, is not nearly as limited or treacherous as the average parent believes. I have discovered alumni working in fields I didn't even know existed, such as composers of music for video games or designers of electronic instruments. We have successful alums who have gone on to law school and become agents, while others start companies in the digital music space. Some teach in public schools, and some work in hospitals as music therapists. The ability to teach an instrument is a powerful form of career insurance—music teachers abound in every village and hamlet on the planet.

A Berklee degree is excellent preparation for a music career, but even if the graduate chooses a different path, the degree gives a student the discipline to master an instrument through daily practice; the leadership skills to organize and prepare ensembles for performances; the analytical and problem-solving skills that come from studying composition, harmony, counterpoint, and music theory; and the creativity to express oneself in a unique and authentic way.

The President's Letter to Parents of Prospective Students (Berklee College, via the Internet Archive Wayback Machine)
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#4
(05-15-2019, 10:02 AM)Jonathan Whatley Wrote:
Roger H. Brown Wrote:Understandably, many parents have anxieties about their children aspiring to have a career in music. I'm reminded of the Willie Nelson lyric, "Mamas don't let your babies grow up to be cowboys. Don't let them pick guitars and drive them old trucks, let them be doctors and lawyers and such." Aspirations for careers in music might be right next to cowboys in generating parental anxiety. I believe the music industry, though no cakewalk, is not nearly as limited or treacherous as the average parent believes. I have discovered alumni working in fields I didn't even know existed, such as composers of music for video games or designers of electronic instruments. We have successful alums who have gone on to law school and become agents, while others start companies in the digital music space. Some teach in public schools, and some work in hospitals as music therapists. The ability to teach an instrument is a powerful form of career insurance—music teachers abound in every village and hamlet on the planet.

A Berklee degree is excellent preparation for a music career, but even if the graduate chooses a different path, the degree gives a student the discipline to master an instrument through daily practice; the leadership skills to organize and prepare ensembles for performances; the analytical and problem-solving skills that come from studying composition, harmony, counterpoint, and music theory; and the creativity to express oneself in a unique and authentic way.

I think you can teach an instrument without having to spend $47k a year in tuition (so $188k for a BA).  Yeah, no.  I guess if your kid got a full scholarship, but other than that, I'm going to say no if my kid wants to do this.

Every music teacher I've known that was really good - I've never asked them if they had a degree, let alone where they got it.  Just teach my kid to play the piano or the guitar, get them excited about learning, and we are good to go.
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#5
I've shared this before, but my brother is a high school music teacher / band director. Of course he has a BA / MA in music - but his degree is in music EDUCATION. His 2 best friends in high school each did it differently. 1 gigs locally and never went to school. He's been out of hs since 91, same as my brother, and has carved out a living for himself, but I also know they struggle. The other went to Juilliard. He has never found good work to my knowledge. I believe he is still just a private lessons instructor and did get symphony work. But, all this to say, my brother has had his job since day 1. In the culinary world, we call this Mise en Place. Good Mise en Place is more than just 1 thing - it's "everything" in its place which includes thinking through the best and worst case scenarios as well as having contingency plans worked in.
Jennifer
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MS Applied Nutrition, 2014 Canisius College, NY
Premed/Prenursing Sciences, 2011 Ocean County College, NJ
BA Social Science, 2008 Thomas Edison State University, NJ
AA General Studies, 2008 Thomas Edison State University, NJ
AOS Culinary Arts,1990 Culinary Institute of America, NY

Homeschooling for College Credit
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#6
Since it's story time, I'll share mine. I don't play an instrument beyond basic keyboarding, but I'm pretty advanced in music production. While I'm okay at mixing, I haven't had the patience to learn mastering. I also don't want to spend the money on the software. Plus, it's advised that people not mix and master their own music. It's the same concept behind getting someone else to edit your writing.

I knew that a local university had a sound production and engineering program, so I figured they would have students willing to mix and master cheaply because they're building their portfolios. I met up with this one student at the university studio so that he could listen to my tracks. While he was listening to one of my songs, he asked, "You learned how to do this yourself?" In that moment, I could see in his eyes that he was thinking, "Why am I paying $9k per year to learn this?"

Music colleges can get you connections and good classical music training if you want to become an instrumentalist. If you just want to produce popular music, the cost is not worth it. I would guess that most of the Top 40 producers and songwriters do not have music degrees.
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#7
Big Grin 
(05-15-2019, 05:34 PM)sanantone Wrote: I would guess that most of the Top 40 producers and songwriters do not have music degrees.

"Most" is a wild understatement  Big Grin 

I'd be surprised if ANY top 40 have a music degree
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#8
(05-15-2019, 06:06 PM)jsd Wrote:
(05-15-2019, 05:34 PM)sanantone Wrote: I would guess that most of the Top 40 producers and songwriters do not have music degrees.

"Most" is a wild understatement  Big Grin 

I'd be surprised if ANY top 40 have a music degree

I know none of the hip hop/trap producers have degrees; some do have formal piano training, though. There are a lot of EDM producers and DJs producing pop now, so you're probably right. I've read the stories of many successful songwriters, and a lot of them started out as music artists who couldn't get their music careers off the ground.
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#9
(05-15-2019, 06:06 PM)jsd Wrote:
(05-15-2019, 05:34 PM)sanantone Wrote: I would guess that most of the Top 40 producers and songwriters do not have music degrees.

"Most" is a wild understatement  Big Grin 

I'd be surprised if ANY top 40 have a music degree

+1
Too true! What's the point anyway? Does a music degree = a top 40 career? How many times on American Idol or The Voice do you see a contestant from such-and-such music school? Most of the ones I see end up frustrating the judges because they are "too" technical or precise. In my estimation, it's a hindrance.
Jennifer
10-year member

MS Applied Nutrition, 2014 Canisius College, NY
Premed/Prenursing Sciences, 2011 Ocean County College, NJ
BA Social Science, 2008 Thomas Edison State University, NJ
AA General Studies, 2008 Thomas Edison State University, NJ
AOS Culinary Arts,1990 Culinary Institute of America, NY

Homeschooling for College Credit
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