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Pink Collar Job Growth is Outpacing Blue Collar Job Growth
#11
If I could give this post five stars I would. So much of this is why I am not married with a family, nor bothering to have a child out of wedlock.
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#12
(02-28-2019, 03:12 PM)sanantone Wrote: The article is explaining why so many men are choosing to stay unemployed or stay with unstable employment. One of the reasons is that so many men either don't have families, or they don't feel obligated to take care of their children. 

If I'm unemployed, I'll take anything.

Sure, I think anyone would, but in a lot of these cases, they aren't jobs these men would just be offered straight up, they would be careers that would require training and/or education in order to enter. These cultural walls are so subconscious, that most men wouldn't even realize that they were on the table. Most people just think of what they would like to do or could see themselves doing when they think about switching careers, they don't systematically research all possibilities.
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#13
(02-28-2019, 05:36 PM)davewill Wrote:
(02-28-2019, 03:12 PM)sanantone Wrote: The article is explaining why so many men are choosing to stay unemployed or stay with unstable employment. One of the reasons is that so many men either don't have families, or they don't feel obligated to take care of their children. 

If I'm unemployed, I'll take anything.

Sure, I think anyone would, but in a lot of these cases, they aren't jobs these men would just be offered straight up, they would be careers that would require training and/or education in order to enter. These cultural walls are so subconscious, that most men wouldn't even realize that they were on the table. Most people just think of what they would like to do or could see themselves doing when they think about switching careers, they don't systematically research all possibilities.

And saying you'll take ANY job if you're unemployed is not that practical.  I mean, do you just throw out your resume to EVERY job in your area?  I wouldn't even know what was available.  You kind of have to look up jobs by type, and then see if you're qualified.  I wouldn't even know where to start in looking for jobs I've not heard of, or know are available.

And, BTW, I would be a TERRIBLE preschool teacher - and even if they'd hire me, do you want to send your preschooler to be with ME every day - someone who doesn't really want to be there?  It's not really something just anyone can do.  I could be a receptionist, but no one would hire me because I'm WAY overqualified.  And I guarantee you they're not going to hire some blue-collar guy to be one!  How about working at a store in the mall?  Are they going to hire a 50yo unemployed construction worker at Abercrombie & Fitch?  Probably not.
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#14
(02-28-2019, 08:34 PM)dfrecore Wrote:
(02-28-2019, 05:36 PM)davewill Wrote:
(02-28-2019, 03:12 PM)sanantone Wrote: The article is explaining why so many men are choosing to stay unemployed or stay with unstable employment. One of the reasons is that so many men either don't have families, or they don't feel obligated to take care of their children. 

If I'm unemployed, I'll take anything.

Sure, I think anyone would, but in a lot of these cases, they aren't jobs these men would just be offered straight up, they would be careers that would require training and/or education in order to enter. These cultural walls are so subconscious, that most men wouldn't even realize that they were on the table. Most people just think of what they would like to do or could see themselves doing when they think about switching careers, they don't systematically research all possibilities.

And saying you'll take ANY job if you're unemployed is not that practical.  I mean, do you just throw out your resume to EVERY job in your area?  I wouldn't even know what was available.  You kind of have to look up jobs by type, and then see if you're qualified.  I wouldn't even know where to start in looking for jobs I've not heard of, or know are available.

And, BTW, I would be a TERRIBLE preschool teacher - and even if they'd hire me, do you want to send your preschooler to be with ME every day - someone who doesn't really want to be there?  It's not really something just anyone can do.  I could be a receptionist, but no one would hire me because I'm WAY overqualified.  And I guarantee you they're not going to hire some blue-collar guy to be one!  How about working at a store in the mall?  Are they going to hire a 50yo unemployed construction worker at Abercrombie & Fitch?  Probably not.

Survival of the fittest. The Internet makes it easy to search for jobs. If you can't manage to do it, then you'll stay unemployed or broke. Hopefully, you won't procreate. 

I've worked a wide variety of jobs in male-dominated and female-dominated fields. I remember when I was being laid off as a newspaper carrier over a decade ago. The warehouse workers were also being laid off. One of them asked me which section of the newspaper I was looking at, and I told him all of them. He said, "You must know how to do a lot." I didn't; I previously did fast food and telemarketing. He said that he was only looking at the general labor section because that's all he had experience in. I took a job as a security officer, and I had never worked in security or any other criminal justice-related job before. I've also worked in healthcare and transportation with no experience. I now work in taxation with no tax experience. Some of the people hired with me don't have degrees; they qualified based on having customer service experience even though it had nothing to do with taxation or accounting. Most of the employees are women, but any guy who has dealt with people for several years would meet the minimum requirements.

A lot of employment problems are caused by people not having basic job searching skills.
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#15
(02-27-2019, 01:47 PM)mysonx3 Wrote:
(02-27-2019, 01:35 PM)cookderosa Wrote:
(02-27-2019, 10:41 AM)dfrecore Wrote:
(02-27-2019, 07:53 AM)sanantone Wrote: There are far more pink collar jobs than blue collar jobs, but many men are declining to take pink collar jobs because it's "women's work." Pink collar jobs are less likely to be off-shored or replaced with automation because they're based on human interaction.
https://www.axios.com/young-men-educatio...c4dc0.html
https://www.forbes.com/sites/neilhowe/20...72c06b6639

They use a lot of jargon, but don't explain any of it.  What exactly are pink-collar jobs?  I mean, a list of more than 2-3 would be nice.

So in looking it up, I agree that my son is not going to do a single one of the jobs listed.  I will note that most are low-paying, and wouldn't support a family, something he would take into account when choosing a career (he's looking at majoring in Mechanical Engineering in college).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pink-collar_worker

This is only the second or third time I've heard the expression, but I understand it to mean "girl" jobs that are labor/hands on as opposed to administrative or c-level. Caregiver roles would be an example - but that's not to say they are unskilled jobs, in the way that a welder would be skilled, and a nurse would be as well.
I think they're just trying to stir the pot lol.
Administrative roles are definitely part of the "pink collar" category. Along with nurse, secretary is one of the two occupations that first come to mind when I think of a "pink collar" job.

I'm showing my age- administration used to mean executive. Once upon a time when I was an administrator I had a secretary. Secretaries are now called admin / admin assistants. We're thinking of the same thing, just using different terms.
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#16
(02-28-2019, 11:20 PM)sanantone Wrote:
(02-28-2019, 08:34 PM)dfrecore Wrote:
(02-28-2019, 05:36 PM)davewill Wrote:
(02-28-2019, 03:12 PM)sanantone Wrote: The article is explaining why so many men are choosing to stay unemployed or stay with unstable employment. One of the reasons is that so many men either don't have families, or they don't feel obligated to take care of their children. 

If I'm unemployed, I'll take anything.

Sure, I think anyone would, but in a lot of these cases, they aren't jobs these men would just be offered straight up, they would be careers that would require training and/or education in order to enter. These cultural walls are so subconscious, that most men wouldn't even realize that they were on the table. Most people just think of what they would like to do or could see themselves doing when they think about switching careers, they don't systematically research all possibilities.

And saying you'll take ANY job if you're unemployed is not that practical.  I mean, do you just throw out your resume to EVERY job in your area?  I wouldn't even know what was available.  You kind of have to look up jobs by type, and then see if you're qualified.  I wouldn't even know where to start in looking for jobs I've not heard of, or know are available.

And, BTW, I would be a TERRIBLE preschool teacher - and even if they'd hire me, do you want to send your preschooler to be with ME every day - someone who doesn't really want to be there?  It's not really something just anyone can do.  I could be a receptionist, but no one would hire me because I'm WAY overqualified.  And I guarantee you they're not going to hire some blue-collar guy to be one!  How about working at a store in the mall?  Are they going to hire a 50yo unemployed construction worker at Abercrombie & Fitch?  Probably not.

Survival of the fittest. The Internet makes it easy to search for jobs. If you can't manage to do it, then you'll stay unemployed or broke. Hopefully, you won't procreate. 

I've worked a wide variety of jobs in male-dominated and female-dominated fields. I remember when I was being laid off as a newspaper carrier over a decade ago. The warehouse workers were also being laid off. One of them asked me which section of the newspaper I was looking at, and I told him all of them. He said, "You must know how to do a lot." I didn't; I previously did fast food and telemarketing. He said that he was only looking at the general labor section because that's all he had experience in. I took a job as a security officer, and I had never worked in security or any other criminal justice-related job before. I've also worked in healthcare and transportation with no experience. I now work in taxation with no tax experience. Some of the people hired with me don't have degrees; they qualified based on having customer service experience even though it had nothing to do with taxation or accounting. Most of the employees are women, but any guy who has dealt with people for several years would meet the minimum requirements.

A lot of employment problems are caused by people not having basic job searching skills.

Yes, but job searching skills are even more complex now.  How would I search for every single job available in my town?  There's no real way to do that.  Newspapers were easy back in the day; I could sit down and go through the entire help wanted section, and grab every single job that was remotely interesting, I thought I could do, etc.  Now, you have to know what you're looking for BEFORE you look for it.  You can't just tell a search engine "give me all of the jobs available in XYZ city," it doesn't work that way.  You need to look up job titles.
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#17
(03-01-2019, 12:44 PM)dfrecore Wrote:
(02-28-2019, 11:20 PM)sanantone Wrote:
(02-28-2019, 08:34 PM)dfrecore Wrote:
(02-28-2019, 05:36 PM)davewill Wrote:
(02-28-2019, 03:12 PM)sanantone Wrote: The article is explaining why so many men are choosing to stay unemployed or stay with unstable employment. One of the reasons is that so many men either don't have families, or they don't feel obligated to take care of their children. 

If I'm unemployed, I'll take anything.

Sure, I think anyone would, but in a lot of these cases, they aren't jobs these men would just be offered straight up, they would be careers that would require training and/or education in order to enter. These cultural walls are so subconscious, that most men wouldn't even realize that they were on the table. Most people just think of what they would like to do or could see themselves doing when they think about switching careers, they don't systematically research all possibilities.

And saying you'll take ANY job if you're unemployed is not that practical.  I mean, do you just throw out your resume to EVERY job in your area?  I wouldn't even know what was available.  You kind of have to look up jobs by type, and then see if you're qualified.  I wouldn't even know where to start in looking for jobs I've not heard of, or know are available.

And, BTW, I would be a TERRIBLE preschool teacher - and even if they'd hire me, do you want to send your preschooler to be with ME every day - someone who doesn't really want to be there?  It's not really something just anyone can do.  I could be a receptionist, but no one would hire me because I'm WAY overqualified.  And I guarantee you they're not going to hire some blue-collar guy to be one!  How about working at a store in the mall?  Are they going to hire a 50yo unemployed construction worker at Abercrombie & Fitch?  Probably not.

Survival of the fittest. The Internet makes it easy to search for jobs. If you can't manage to do it, then you'll stay unemployed or broke. Hopefully, you won't procreate. 

I've worked a wide variety of jobs in male-dominated and female-dominated fields. I remember when I was being laid off as a newspaper carrier over a decade ago. The warehouse workers were also being laid off. One of them asked me which section of the newspaper I was looking at, and I told him all of them. He said, "You must know how to do a lot." I didn't; I previously did fast food and telemarketing. He said that he was only looking at the general labor section because that's all he had experience in. I took a job as a security officer, and I had never worked in security or any other criminal justice-related job before. I've also worked in healthcare and transportation with no experience. I now work in taxation with no tax experience. Some of the people hired with me don't have degrees; they qualified based on having customer service experience even though it had nothing to do with taxation or accounting. Most of the employees are women, but any guy who has dealt with people for several years would meet the minimum requirements.

A lot of employment problems are caused by people not having basic job searching skills.

Yes, but job searching skills are even more complex now.  How would I search for every single job available in my town?  There's no real way to do that.  Newspapers were easy back in the day; I could sit down and go through the entire help wanted section, and grab every single job that was remotely interesting, I thought I could do, etc.  Now, you have to know what you're looking for BEFORE you look for it.  You can't just tell a search engine "give me all of the jobs available in XYZ city," it doesn't work that way.  You need to look up job titles.

Searching by job title is one of the worst things you can do unless your field almost always uses one job title. For example, there's an endless number of job titles for positions that require a peace officer certification: park ranger, game warden, deputy, investigator, agent, police officer, school resource officer, public safety officer, arson investigator, etc. It's better to search by skills, certification, a keyword for past experience (i.e. sales), and/or degree major. 

I have Indeed alerts for "entry-level," "trainee," and "apprentice." You can also create an alert for "no experience" because some job ads will say "no experience required."

I just thought of some other good search phrases based on what I've seen in job ads.

"training provided"
"willing to train"
"we will train"

To further explain my method, because this might help some, it's a science of identifying common phrases in job ads. Put quotes around the phrase to get results that only include that exact phrase. Don't include unnecessary words. I searched "no experience" and got 253 job openings in my city. I saw "no experience required," "no experience necessary," and "no experience needed." This is why I simply searched "no experience."
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#18
(02-27-2019, 07:53 AM)sanantone Wrote: There are far more pink collar jobs than blue collar jobs, but many men are declining to take pink collar jobs because it's "women's work." Pink collar jobs are less likely to be off-shored or replaced with automation because they're based on human interaction.
https://www.axios.com/young-men-educatio...c4dc0.html
https://www.forbes.com/sites/neilhowe/20...72c06b6639
I apologize, as I am about to go off on a tangent.  I generally don't do this, but....
Although there are a few high-paying "pink collar" jobs, such as dental hygiene, some of the pink collar fields are in crisis.  I find it almost biased or possibly a lack of thorough research that the authors of both articles did not breach the topic. 
Personal Health Care and Home Health Aides are a controversial issue, in some ways. They are generally very low paying, and are high stress jobs.  Incidentally, they are in higher demand in places where the cost of living is steep, and the housing prices are astronomical.  Snowbirds with money get home health aides, and tend to live in places that the aide cannot afford to buy or even rent.  Over the past decade there has been a push by the government and employment services to ease the recipients of social services off of these programs and into training for these aide jobs.  That created a dearth of programs for training low skilled people for low pay jobs.  The attrition is high.  Abuse and theft are rampant.  My neighbor has a home health aide for her terminally ill son.  She complains and protests every time she gets a new aide, because she simply doesn't like them or trust them around her kid.  Most of them have to bus into our neighborhood from 30 miles away, because they cannot afford $1600 a month for rent for a two bedroom.  They usually do not last long. 
While these jobs may never get outsourced, I am not sure that they are a viable career choice for anyone.   Many of these jobs are not uplifting, spiritually or financially.  While we are in a shortage for medical aides, it is not because people are not able to do the job, but because it isn't worth it, at the present pay rates.
On the other hand, many areas of the country are experiencing a housing boom.   There is a HUGE shortage of qualified HVAC, Electricians, plumbers and other skilled workers that are retiring,  that so far millenials are not wanting to replace.   There is plenty of opportunity there for both men and women to enter those fields with very little student loan debt.
We put more of a value on urban sprawl than we do on the health of our seniors and terminally ill.  I do get the point that there are a lot of untapped fields in medicine, etc., that provide nicely for little educational investment.  Big R.O.I.
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#19
It's interesting that people will advise women to go into the trades, even though the work environment can be hostile for women, but those same people will make excuses for unemployed men not taking pink collar jobs. There are also blue collar jobs in crisis i.e. manufacturing and just about anything that can be done by robots or in a developing country.
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#20
(04-01-2019, 11:48 AM)sanantone Wrote: It's interesting that people will advise women to go into the trades, even though the work environment can be hostile for women, but those same people will make excuses for unemployed men not taking pink collar jobs. There are also blue collar jobs in crisis i.e. manufacturing and just about anything that can be done by robots or in a developing country.

And, I would be remiss if I suggested that they couldn't go into those trades.

Every work environment can be hostile for women, and that is definitely a topic that needs addressed, and I certainly hope that it is being addressed much more seriously than it has been in the past.

I will also add that my unemployed male friend recently took advantage of job retraining, after a layoff, and earned his LPN Certification. This is a 6'7", 295 pound man. A few patients complained that they were a bit concerned over his bedside manner. Bascially, if I were female, I might not want him attending to specific hygiene needs. However, given his size and his skillset, he has found a niche in the Mental Health industry. His peers like having him around for working with combative and unruly patients. Everyone has their niche.

Also, I wasn't suggesting that your original post was incorrect, I was probably making more of a statement about the current state of our healthcare system and the value that we put on some things over others.
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