TESC Living Expense Loans

[dcan]

I keep reading that you are applying for retail jobs. What else have you applied for? Retail sucks right now, but everybody needs pizza. Walk around downtown with a bucket and offer to wash the windows of every single store you walk by, $2 per window or something like that. You have two hands and two feet and a brain, use it to put yourself ahead of the other guy.

Seriously here, you are wanting to go massively in debt to get a degree which will only check off the "has a degree" block on resumes. You are doing this on the HOPE that you get into a Fed program and get a stipend to pay off the loan, and the HOPE that Murphy doesn't become your permanent roommate and car passenger.

You are setting yourself up to do serious acrobatics on very thin ice, because if ANYTHING goes wrong you can instantly find yourself screwed and still at least a decade in debt.

I've got a better plan, if you are game for it. Join the Air Force. Heck, any branch, but given your goals, join the Air Force. You sound like a go-getter from the start and given your background (esp. the management part) you sound like a perfect fit. Here's what you get:

• Guaranteed promotion through E-4 (assuming you aren't a screwup, which you've already demonstrated you aren't)
  
• Free room & board (one person to a room is by far the norm, and AF chow is the envy of the world) through E-4 or so, then housing allowance + food allowance to live off base (in addition to your base pay, btw allowances are TAX FREE)
  
• 100% Tuition Assistance through a Master's degree
  
• Post-9/11 GI Bill (36 months paid college)
  
• Multiple career fields in Computers and Computer Security
  
• Unlimited free CLEPs/etc (the first time you take each test is free)
  
• Practically get an automatic Associate's Degree in your career field (Community College of the Air Force)
  

Most importantly, you get a MASSIVE support network, both on and off base. Mentoring is part of the deal, and there are TONS of opportunities for personal growth both in and out of your job in areas you never thought about before.

Plus get into one of the below fields, get your degree or two, and then slide right into a cushy contractor gig working at the same desk, or apply to be a federal civil servant in the field.

Here's some job descriptions for you with links to full descriptions of job functions, training, etc from About.com. Basically Programmers write the code, Operators implement the systems/networks hosting the code, and Cyber Surety secures the systems and network. I am a 3D0X4, PM me if you have any questions at all.

3D0X3, Cyber Surety (aka Computer/Network Security) AFSC is officially established on November 1, 2009. Cyber Surety personnel supervise or operate fixed and deployed information technology (IT) resources to monitor, evaluate and maintain systems, policy and procedures to protect clients, networks, data/voice systems and databases from unauthorized activity. They identify potential threats and manage resolution of security violations. 3D0X3 personnel enforce national, DoD and Air Force security policies and directives; employ hardware and software tools to enhance the security by installing, monitoring and directing proactive and reactive information protection and defensive measures to ensure Confidentiality, Integrity and Availability (CIA) of IT resources. They administer and manage the overall Information Assurance (IA) program to include Communications Security (COMSEC), Emissions Security (EMSEC) and Computer Security (COMPUSEC) programs.

[URL="http://usmilitary.about.com/od/airforceenlistedjobs/a/3d0x2.htm"]
3D0X2, Cyber Systems Operations[/URL] (aka System/Network Administration) AFSC is officially established on November 1, 2009. Cyber Systems Operations personnel supervise and perform cyber systems operations and executes associated information systems support programs, both at home base and at deployed locations. They perform system administration on, Command, Control, Communications, Computer (C4), Intelligence, and various functional area platforms. Core competencies include: server operating systems, database administration and web technologies. Administers: server-based operating systems, distributed applications, network storage, messaging, and application monitoring, required to integrate cyber systems and applications. 3D0X2 personnel support identification, reconnaissance and exploitation of vulnerabilities while enhancing capabilities within cyber environments to achieve desired affects.

3D0X4, Computer Systems Programming AFSC is officially established on November 1, 2009. It was created by converting AFSC 3C0X2. Computer Systems Programming personnel supervise and perform as computer analyst, coder, tester and manager in the design, development, maintenance, testing, configuration management, and documentation of application software systems, client-server, and web-enabled software and relational database systems critical to warfighting capabilities.

I'm going to tell you like I would tell an Airman -- you can set yourself up for a world of hurt going down the road you are contemplating, with a LOT of unknown variables not accounted for. There are always other options. I'd hate to see you get screwed in the long term for something you HOPE will work out, without leaving yourself any pad for things to go wrong.

Like I said, if interested in the AF feel free to PM me, I work in the field you are interested in and can answer lots of questions about military and federal info assurance.

[rebel100]

Going into debt like you are contemplating is just crazy. Don't do it, your gonna regret it. Your setting yourelf up for much greater difficulty down the road.

Air Force idea sounds like a winner. You've been given a lot of good advice. Note also that most of the regular posters here complete an entire 4 year degree for about half (or less) than your contemplating borrowing.

And just as a practical matter, I don't know what makes you think there is that kind of loan out there. I mean a school will loan you the moneu perhaps, but it's going to be largely eaten up with tuition and expenses.

You really need to re-think this, it's a BAD BAD isea.

Of course when I was your age I knew everything too, some kids actually have to touch the glowing burner to understand it will burn you.

Good Luck,

Reb,

[Derek]

I keep reading that you are applying for retail jobs. What else have you applied for? Retail sucks right now, but everybody needs pizza. Walk around downtown with a bucket and offer to wash the windows of every single store you walk by, $2 per window or something like that. You have two hands and two feet and a brain, use it to put yourself ahead of the other guy.

Seriously here, you are wanting to go massively in debt to get a degree which will only check off the "has a degree" block on resumes. You are doing this on the HOPE that you get into a Fed program and get a stipend to pay off the loan, and the HOPE that Murphy doesn't become your permanent roommate and car passenger.

You are setting yourself up to do serious acrobatics on very thin ice, because if ANYTHING goes wrong you can instantly find yourself screwed and still at least a decade in debt.

I've got a better plan, if you are game for it. Join the Air Force. Heck, any branch, but given your goals, join the Air Force. You sound like a go-getter from the start and given your background (esp. the management part) you sound like a perfect fit. Here's what you get:

• Guaranteed promotion through E-4 (assuming you aren't a screwup, which you've already demonstrated you aren't)
  
• Free room & board (one person to a room is by far the norm, and AF chow is the envy of the world) through E-4 or so, then housing allowance + food allowance to live off base (in addition to your base pay, btw allowances are TAX FREE)
  
• 100% Tuition Assistance through a Master's degree
  
• Post-9/11 GI Bill (36 months paid college)
  
• Multiple career fields in Computers and Computer Security
  
• Unlimited free CLEPs/etc (the first time you take each test is free)
  
• Practically get an automatic Associate's Degree in your career field (Community College of the Air Force)
  

Most importantly, you get a MASSIVE support network, both on and off base. Mentoring is part of the deal, and there are TONS of opportunities for personal growth both in and out of your job in areas you never thought about before.

Plus get into one of the below fields, get your degree or two, and then slide right into a cushy contractor gig working at the same desk, or apply to be a federal civil servant in the field.

Here's some job descriptions for you with links to full descriptions of job functions, training, etc from About.com. Basically Programmers write the code, Operators implement the systems/networks hosting the code, and Cyber Surety secures the systems and network. I am a 3D0X4, PM me if you have any questions at all.



I'm going to tell you like I would tell an Airman -- you can set yourself up for a world of hurt going down the road you are contemplating, with a LOT of unknown variables not accounted for. There are always other options. I'd hate to see you get screwed in the long term for something you HOPE will work out, without leaving yourself any pad for things to go wrong.

Like I said, if interested in the AF feel free to PM me, I work in the field you are interested in and can answer lots of questions about military and federal info assurance.

I've applied to everything that I didn't need a specific degree for. I've applied to retail, laborer, contractors, landscaping, dry cleaning, banking, telemarketing, etc. Haha. On top of that, I've also followed up with the highest managerial person I could find, and introduced myself in person.

I was actually Navy bound right out of High School... ended up letting my Ex talk me out of it.. somehow. Now I'm kicking myself.

Had a very hefty signing bonus that came with an instant E-3 right out of boot camp and E-5 after A-School I qualified with a 98 on the ASVABs and had qualified to every position through the advanced placement. I seriously regret not going forward with it... Even though I'd be in for a 6 year term working in a power plant. :p But than again, I wouldn't be with my wonderful fiance now.

There's two main reasons I've steered clear of the military since... One being my relationship obligations. I would've gone in last May, however, let's just say her wanting to come live with me after I get settled in didn't go very well with her parents... More like World War III. Lead to her and her mother not speaking for a year and negatively affected our relationship for that entire year... I'd prefer to keep her and not let that happen again. And the second, being much more recent.. As of 3 weeks ago, I believe. A friend of mine, scored highly on his ASVABs and Advanced Placement testing, no medical issues, etc. Got a call from his recruiter telling him that he passed everything, etc. etc. HOWEVER, they cut back on new recruits and would not be able to take any more personnel at this time.

And on top of that, I'd need a waiver. I had a little slip up a 2 years ago. Just a little misdemeanor, but one frowned upon in the great state of NJ... Would it be easy to get? Possibly. Time consuming? Definitely.

Isn't there a limit on personal debt that would prevent one from enlisting as well?

[sanantone]

Going off of Dcan's post, if your city is hiring police officers, go for it. I know, at least in my city, that the major city police department has its own academy and pays you while you're training. One industry that is always hiring is corrections. I work in security management and I can tell you the easiest job you can get is that of a security officer. The pay is from minimum wage to about $12 an hour depending on the region and whether you're armed or not and there is usually plenty of overtime. If you get one of those cozy posts, you might even be able to do your homework.

There are also companies that hire customer service representatives who work from home. Most (but not all) will require you to pay for your own background check. These companies are legitimate and I've seen them featured on the news and the local newspaper. Here's an article on them.

Work-From-Home Questions Answered - ABC News

Rest assured, becoming a home-based customer service agent is not an envelope-stuffing scam and it's not a pyramid scheme where you're signing up simply to recruit other people.

This is legitimate home-based work for which more than 100,000 people across the country are being paid for their part- and full-time services handling customer inquiries for some of the biggest brands in the world, including AAA Auto Clubs, Walgreens, Virgin Atlantic, 1-800-Flowers, J. Crew, and many more.

Just in case you still have doubts, here are reviews saying that Alpine Access is a legit company even though there are some complaints mixed in.

Alpine Access Reviews - Legit or Scam?

Here are some reviews on Willow CSN which now goes by Arise.

Has anyone checked out Willow CSN?

VIPdesk

Is VIPdesk.com A Scam? | Work At Home No Scams.com

[CLEP101]

I keep reading that you are applying for retail jobs. What else have you applied for? Retail sucks right now, but everybody needs pizza. Walk around downtown with a bucket and offer to wash the windows of every single store you walk by, $2 per window or something like that. You have two hands and two feet and a brain, use it to put yourself ahead of the other guy.

Seriously here, you are wanting to go massively in debt to get a degree which will only check off the "has a degree" block on resumes. You are doing this on the HOPE that you get into a Fed program and get a stipend to pay off the loan, and the HOPE that Murphy doesn't become your permanent roommate and car passenger.

You are setting yourself up to do serious acrobatics on very thin ice, because if ANYTHING goes wrong you can instantly find yourself screwed and still at least a decade in debt.

I've got a better plan, if you are game for it. Join the Air Force. Heck, any branch, but given your goals, join the Air Force. You sound like a go-getter from the start and given your background (esp. the management part) you sound like a perfect fit. Here's what you get:

• Guaranteed promotion through E-4 (assuming you aren't a screwup, which you've already demonstrated you aren't)
  
• Free room & board (one person to a room is by far the norm, and AF chow is the envy of the world) through E-4 or so, then housing allowance + food allowance to live off base (in addition to your base pay, btw allowances are TAX FREE)
  
• 100% Tuition Assistance through a Master's degree
  
• Post-9/11 GI Bill (36 months paid college)
  
• Multiple career fields in Computers and Computer Security
  
• Unlimited free CLEPs/etc (the first time you take each test is free)
  
• Practically get an automatic Associate's Degree in your career field (Community College of the Air Force)
  

Most importantly, you get a MASSIVE support network, both on and off base. Mentoring is part of the deal, and there are TONS of opportunities for personal growth both in and out of your job in areas you never thought about before.

Plus get into one of the below fields, get your degree or two, and then slide right into a cushy contractor gig working at the same desk, or apply to be a federal civil servant in the field.

Here's some job descriptions for you with links to full descriptions of job functions, training, etc from About.com. Basically Programmers write the code, Operators implement the systems/networks hosting the code, and Cyber Surety secures the systems and network. I am a 3D0X4, PM me if you have any questions at all.



I'm going to tell you like I would tell an Airman -- you can set yourself up for a world of hurt going down the road you are contemplating, with a LOT of unknown variables not accounted for. There are always other options. I'd hate to see you get screwed in the long term for something you HOPE will work out, without leaving yourself any pad for things to go wrong.

Like I said, if interested in the AF feel free to PM me, I work in the field you are interested in and can answer lots of questions about military and federal info assurance.

:iagree:
I'm with dcan on this, The Air Force does have the best food and live like they're spoiled - that's about it:roflol:

I would give you the same advice dcan just did. On a serious note, don't be Army haters, they will probably take you even with a misdemeanor. However, you choices of jobs will be limited. If you have debt, it doesn't affect you joining, it will only affect the level of security clearance you'd get and job choices.
If you are concerned about going away, why don't you just join the Reserves for any branch. Go off to trainig, and then come back home. you'll get your Work paycheck and the reserve paycheck. On top of a bonus, and Tuition Assistance, and GI Bill. Don't have to enlist for that long either, check into the 2 or 3 year programs. That way you can keep your girl because she'll be living with you at home, not off in a military base far away.

[mrs.b]

:iagree:
I'm with dcan on this, The Air Force does have the best food and live like they're spoiled - that's about it:roflol:

I would give you the same advice dcan just did. On a serious note, don't be Army haters, they will probably take you even with a misdemeanor. However, you choices of jobs will be limited. If you have debt, it doesn't affect you joining, it will only affect the level of security clearance you'd get and job choices.
If you are concerned about going away, why don't you just join the Reserves for any branch. Go off to trainig, and then come back home. you'll get your Work paycheck and the reserve paycheck. On top of a bonus, and Tuition Assistance, and GI Bill. Don't have to enlist for that long either, check into the 2 or 3 year programs. That way you can keep your girl because she'll be living with you at home, not off in a military base far away.

Joining the military, even Reservist, is another check mark on a lot of applications (not all, mind, but many). With the Fed stepping up to more-heavily enforce EEO regulations, there is additional protection for women, minorities, disabled, and military, to ensure hiring practices are fair, and you're more likely to make it through to at least interviews with that on a resume.


Edit: On the recruiter stating they're not taking more personnel at this time, as it's been explained to me (those serving would be able to clarify or correct much better), recruiters have a quota to meet so they do not tap an area out. If they've met their quota for the area already this month, they may "save" ready-to-go recruits for a future quota period. It does not necessarily mean they're not actually taking anyone, it means that recruiter is not this month. Hopefully someone else can confirm or correct that. Either way, going in yourself and asking for yourself does not do anything but perhaps waste an afternoon.

Also, please take this in the spirit it's intended - a non-invested perspective - Please consider all your alternatives, without potential-mother-in-law consequences weighting them, and decide what is best for YOU. The military/Reservist angle is another excellent suggestion, avoiding debt, and giving you so many benefits above where you're at right now. It's a guaranteed long-term job (so long as you don't screw up big), and when you're ready to return to the civilian workforce, is such a huge boon on your resume in your selected field.

[dcan]

Edit: On the recruiter stating they're not taking more personnel at this time, as it's been explained to me (those serving would be able to clarify or correct much better), recruiters have a quota to meet so they do not tap an area out. If they've met their quota for the area already this month, they may "save" ready-to-go recruits for a future quota period. It does not necessarily mean they're not actually taking anyone, it means that recruiter is not this month. Hopefully someone else can confirm or correct that. Either way, going in yourself and asking for yourself does not do anything but perhaps waste an afternoon.

This is true. I worked a few years at the AF recruiting HQ (IT department, not as a recruiter) and this kind of stuff happened all the time.

No, they do not have a quota. They have a goal. That way if you ask if they have a quota they can say no and they didn't lie to you.

Misdemeanors are easily dealt with. There is a waiver for EVERYTHING. Trust me, looking through the recruiting database we maintained, it's shocking how many people smoked pot, got in trouble with the law, and were at least charged with some very serious stuff. Hopefully they all worked out.

Like CLEP101 said, you can also consider Army. AF and Navy give you jobs and teach you management and leadership. The Army will teach you leadership and management. It's a subtle but important distinction. I worked w/ the Infantry in Afghanistan and saw that first-hand. It all depends on what you want.

BTW I had a 98 ASVAB too. Navy nuke recruiters wouldn't leave me alone either.

FYI AF deployments are typically six months, not 12-15 like the others. Also, you have a deployment window of about 6 months out of every 18-30 months or so, depending on your field. Of course, needs of the AF mean you can be called anytime, but mostly people go in their window, IF they get called at all. It is NOT a guarantee. I haven't gone in five years now. For the most part, when you DO deploy, a lot of the assignments are (relatively) cushy places like Qatar and Kuwait. Though like I said, I did deploy w/ some Infantry to Afghanistan a few years back, and that was waaaaay out in the middle of nowhere. But it was a hell of an experience.

EDIT Here's a post on CommGuys.net about an AF comm guy (imagine that) who went to DEFCON and is talking about a new DNS vulnerability. Forgot to mention, you get all kinds of training and get to go to all kinds of conferences.

EDIT 2 Almost forgot about this. Spouse Tuition Assistance through the MyCAA program, up to $4,000 towards an associate's or certification.

[Yenisei]

Haven't read past the first page on this thread, so forgive me if my suggestion is redundant, but have you considered the military? If I were joining up today, I'd look at the Coast Guard first, the the Air Force and then the Navy. Reserves/Nat Guard would be my first choice, then active duty. Of course you'll get especially good technical training in the AF and Navy.

Just a suggestion.

EDIT: Just saw the bit about the misdemeanor. I think that will probably take you out of consideration for the Air Force or Navy, and the Army may not be as accomodating as in the past; however, woth great ASVAB scores you might have a better shot- I don't know. The misdemeanor, depending on what it was, could be a problem when it comes to getting a clearance, which the best jobs require.

As far as debt goes, it depends on the nature and size of it- the bigges problem may be overdue debt, but again this is a bigger issue for jobs requiring a clearance.

[Stitching Belle]

Don't do it, don't do it, don't do it.

Seriously, don't do it.

You've already read all the reasons not to do it, and lots of alternatives to taking out the loan. Now get busy making it happen.

[CLEP101]

Haven't read past the first page on this thread, so forgive me if my suggestion is redundant, but have you considered the military? If I were joining up today, I'd look at the Coast Guard first, the the Air Force and then the Navy. Reserves/Nat Guard would be my first choice, then active duty. Of course you'll get especially good technical training in the AF and Navy.

"Sigh" Another Army Hater, What's wrong with the Technical Training the Army has? Not all of us are Combat Arms you know, I'm in the 25 series MOS (Job) Telecommunications/SATCOM, Video Teleconferencing, Information management, IT security, Information Assurance, A+, Net +, Sec +, certifications come out of the jobs I do. (computer guy type stuff). At my level, all those MOS's combine into one since I have to manage where everyone goes and works. Heck I have more Navy and Airforce working for me doing all those jobs over here in Afghanistan. The only thing we don't have in the Army are Subs (Navy)and fixed wing planes (Airforce). I think we even have better Ships (Boats) than the Navy.hilarious
World Navies Today: US Army

The funny thing is that when I was a recruiter, I tried to get people to join the safer techy jobs, but they all wanted to blow $hit up and join combat arms jobs. About 70% of the folks I enlisted into the Army wanted that, everyone else wanted admin or technical jobs.