PhD IT, $383 PCH, Bachelors entry, thoughts!?

[armstrongsubero]

@sanatone I'm not arguing. Dint I say that? It was my first line. Seriously. You just missed my point, I wasnt arguing anything, so of course you domt know. Ah, duh?

You are right, you dont need a degree to join. But you know what two recruits have the same qualifications? They'll take the one with the BA in CJ. You want to go up in rank? Well if you and another officer have the similar merit, you know what the one with rhe BA in CJ will be selected. You want to run a department? Well the one with the PhD in CJ will get the postion over the one with just a high school diploma.

So they are right. It does make you more competetive!

You make it sound like professors know nothing about the job market, when in fact the job market is driven by what they say. The community based policing thing here is a good example of that. If it werent researched by professors and put into books, then my ex comissioner could not implement it.

You missed my point with ACE as well. Well if you dont inderstand I'm not going to bother breaking it down.

With the forsenic and accounting programs. I think grads of those programs have a better chance of passing the professional cert than a high school grad.

Its your education. If you are doing a program that dosent give you hands on but a dummy to practice on or something. I have bought literally 10s of thousands of dollars setting up a home eletronics lab cause I know one day I want that EE degree and if I cant gdt it, i taught myself enough to build prototype products or pass an interview. School is a guide, its up to you to practive what you learn.

I could read a book on surgey all day. If I dont get a scalpel and practice on mice or dummy or whatever I'll never get good.

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@sanatone I could listen to you, or I could listen to what the University has to say. Hmmm I think I'll stick with the University. After all you pay them for what they know, not the other way around.

And IQ has the least math not IS.

I know one guy with an HR degree that works as an acturial analyst for an insurance company, he learned on the job. I know people with CIS degrees that DO work in the comm and telcom industry, its very common in fact. They all had the right connections.

Enough of this silly topic already. All that matters to me is what universities have to say on this and using Google a little solidifed my standpoint.

I cant wait to start the Little Rock PhD program or Aspen DSc. Dr. here I come! I already know what I want to research!!

People who have connections and learned on the job are not good examples of a degree program training them to do a particular job. You defeated your own argument. 

Universities are good at teaching basic skills, but professors are usually not knowledgeable of the current job market either because they were never in it or because they've been out of it for a long time. They can give you advice on the academic job market, and that's about it.

For example, many of my PhD professors swear that a criminal justice degree will make you more completitive for civil service, law enforcement jobs. That is not the case at all. The only professor who knows this is not the case is the one who used to be a state trooper. The other professors who believe in this fairy tale have never even applied to a law enforcement agency. I have applied to many law enforcement agencies, and I worked for a few. 

Now, who has better knowledge of the criminal justice job market? A student who has worked for and applied to law enforcement agencies, or a 50-year old professor who has been teaching for the past 20 years?

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@sanatone I could listen to you, or I could listen to what the University has to say. Hmmm I think I'll stick with the University. After all you pay them for what they know, not the other way around.

And IQ has the least math not IS.

I know one guy with an HR degree that works as an acturial analyst for an insurance company, he learned on the job. I know people with CIS degrees that DO work in the comm and telcom industry, its very common in fact. They all had the right connections.

Enough of this silly topic already. All that matters to me is what universities have to say on this and using Google a little solidifed my standpoint.

I cant wait to start the Little Rock PhD program or Aspen DSc. Dr. here I come! I already know what I want to research!!

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@sanantone nope, I beg to differ. Can't comment much for obvious reasons. All I can say once we went from a force ro a service crime rose. Recently our former commissioner was fired and a ex-military man was put to add the agression that was lost. A new zero tolerance approch is being adopted. Crime is decresing because of it.

I knew you would say that. All the CJ stuff really dosent apply everywhere. Our former comissioner was a CJ guy implenting all the text book policies. Culture is different everwhere and those mumbo jumbo theories dont work everywhere. After all, they're not laws.

Since we got a more operations based man whi shows his agression and states its zero tolerance, and I quote him "Its one shot, one kill" crime IS decreasing. We needed that agression back, and I am glad!

So yeah assertive works in a developed country. In a developing yeah, not so much.

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And it applies to academia too! Gotta attack those courses! Attack the research! Fight the sleep! Else you wash out....like I said its my opinion and it works for me. Im not saying to be violent. But you can't be passive in life.

Most of us live in the U.S., a developed country. When I worked corrections, the aggressive officers were the ones who were always assaulted. The more intelligent officers with good communication skills were good at deescalating situations. Research in the U.S. has shown that Broken Windows policing does not work, but community policing does.

I don't know if you've ever worked in the U.S. Our arguments are based on our experiences in the U.S. If your opinions come from your country, then there really is no logic in telling Americans that they're wrong.

As do you in telling me agression is wrong and assertive works. I am a police officer, I worked the streets for a bit. Our ex comissioner used that same research from there and implented it here 'intelligence led and community based policing' and a matter of fact he changed our mission to incorporate that. Well now the crime is so bad, UK travel aganecies were warning against coming and multiple documentaries by international entities were done here.

What did our goodly man do in response to all of this? Well he started a TV program where the heads of divisions could interact directly with  members of the public, see a police officer doing something? Film them and send it to us! Call us! Talk to the heads of the divisons directly. Hot a complaint? Come directly to my offiice. Call me directly. And that show still runs today an hour every day and people still go directly to seniors without the proper chain of command.

Well people only recorded when officers executed their job, and not what led to the situation. People also made false acquasation on offciers and they are penalized since 'the public is first' and officers were suspended once the media and members of the public felt it was bad, and officers were suspended pending false allegations.

This way made things worse and crime increased since officers were fearful members of the public would film them and lie on them and neglected to do thier jobs.

So yeah, the community based policing thing, works to a point, but it should not over run everything. Broken Windows Policing still works, and I'm not a professor (yet) I m a guy in the field. And when larger countries print these things working in thier country in the text book and ship it to our universites, we have no choice but to learn it, and the implementation causes chaos.

And corrections officers are genrally assaulted and targeted more by the criminal community. It is here and in Canada as well based on what a friend I have in corrections across their tells me a rise in violence in the prisons there recently causing more injuries.

Look, the sheriff's department I worked for used to have inmate-on-officer assaults on a weekly basis. They changed their training to emphasize communication skills, and the number of assaults went down dramatically. I had officers who had been in corrections for decades telling me that the key to not being assaulted frequently is not being an a-hole. You don't even need research for this. It's just common sense. All that stuff you're talking about has nothing to do with community policing. Community policing is a proactive policing style that looks to prevent crime rather than react to it. It's about forming relationships with the community so that they feel comfortable with reporting criminal activities. You have the same officers working the same areas so that they get to know what goes on in a neighborhood.

Did you even read my post?
So setting up a direct line to talk to the comissioner, allowing civilians to directly go into the office of any senior officer at will without appointment or through the ranks and having a live TV program where you can call and interact with heads of divisions is not community based policing? Having the abiltiy to recored without restrction officers performing duty and reporting any activtiy carried out by officers on mobile, foot or bicycle is not community policing? Seriously? Well a lot changed since I did that course. Tell Oliver and Mann they need to write new books.

And its different here. People respect the A'hole cause you cant boss him around. There are some officers people see and challenge their authority, cause they are push overs, and when they work it's a hard night. They are usually filmed getting assaulted and persons helping others escape from them. They have the shift very busy, 'heavy' as we say.

Those guys you're talking about when they are out on patrol, you can be sure the phone rings a lot less and the night passes smoothly....

Its jusy my experience. That isnt a theory and didnt come from a book, I see it everyday..