Additional degrees, just because?

[burbuja0512]

I am planning on getting a PhD in business administration but do not have the desire to manage people at this point in time.
I think that I can act as a consultant and make lots of money without having to approve vacations, perform reviews, handle personality conflicts, provide coaching and mentoring and all of those things that are better left to people with psychology and HR degrees in my opinion.
I want to focus on strategic management direction, product development, architecture and other long-term planning projects and leave the people management and day-to-day project management to others.

Is this too much to ask?

Management is just adult babysitting.. ugh seriously. If I have learned anything in management it's to stay in touch with people that I know that are good workers. Then, when you have an opening, hire someone that you already know doesn't need micro-management.

I am not kidding - I would prefer to hire a mediocre worker that was dedicated and low maintenance over a top-performing drama queen (or king) ANY day of the week. I have a short list of people that I want to work with again. I've already hired one of them at my new company. Right now we're not hiring but I already know who I will call next.

Maybe there is a lesson to be learned about the importance of getting along with your boss. I know for a fact that I'm not the only one that keeps a short list of favorite employees in the back of my mind. I would think that if you manage to always work well with your boss and be hard-working, professional, and have a positive attitude then you will probably have a job as long as your boss stays in management, regardless of what company they're at.

[bricabrac]

I am not kidding - I would prefer to hire a mediocre worker that was dedicated and low maintenance over a top-performing drama queen (or king) ANY day of the week. I have a short list of people that I want to work with again. I've already hired one of them at my new company. Right now we're not hiring but I already know who I will call next.

Maybe there is a lesson to be learned about the importance of getting along with your boss. I know for a fact that I'm not the only one that keeps a short list of favorite employees in the back of my mind. I would think that if you manage to always work well with your boss and be hard-working, professional, and have a positive attitude then you will probably have a job as long as your boss stays in management, regardless of what company they're at.

Nothing new in the pharmaceutical industry (or any other major business for that matter) ...there is actually a term = cronyism milelol:

[burbuja0512]

Nothing new in the pharmaceutical industry (or any other major business for that matter) ...there is actually a term = cronyism milelol:

Awwwww.... hate to think of my hiring attitude like that. I just can't figure out the secret of hiring someone that will be a great employee. Seems like the people that have the best interviews end up being my most difficult "kids" to babysit. Maybe the problem will get better once I get out of middle management and move up the corporate ladder.. If I'm hiring for senior-level positions, it would have to be better, right??

[CLEP101]

Awwwww.... hate to think of my hiring attitude like that. I just can't figure out the secret of hiring someone that will be a great employee. Seems like the people that have the best interviews end up being my most difficult "kids" to babysit. Maybe the problem will get better once I get out of middle management and move up the corporate ladder.. If I'm hiring for senior-level positions, it would have to be better, right??

Well If you want, once I retire I can give you the worst interview and then you can hire me Just tell me what degree I need and I'll have it by then. I assure you I will not need babysitting. Unless you stick me in an entry level position.

[bricabrac]

Awwwww.... hate to think of my hiring attitude like that.

I didn't mean this negatively, I actually see it as a positive.

Maybe the problem will get better once I get out of middle management and move up the corporate ladder.. If I'm hiring for senior-level positions, it would have to be better, right??.

No, it's actually worse the higher up you go because there is much more at stake. That's why most executives within six months to a year fire (downsize) the existing staff and bring in their own teams. When executives are pushed out they receive nice packages. Their team will soon receive the boot, again with nice packages. The leader moves to the next company, wash, rinse, repeat. I happen to know a few who have gone up the chain of command and become quite comfortable at a young age within this system. If it ain't broke...don't fix it.

Seems like the people that have the best interviews end up being my most difficult "kids" to babysit.

So true!! I actually give those who have the game face and use the current buzz words the thumbs down. I prefer candidates who have be to drawn out.

[scorched]

I too have been considering multiple degrees, mainly because I am looking at some MS Eng degrees, that have some steep admit requirements, where a single BA or BS from either TESC or EC will not cover it. But a combination of degrees in Comp Sci and Math or Science would.

@burbuja0512 .. alot of the problem today is what I have seen mentioned in threads about a sense of entitlement. Unfortunately people with big degrees feel entitled or the peter principal takes hold and people get promoted to their level of incompetence. So here I sit with no degree, babysitting MBA based CIO's everyday who can barely calculate CAGR or can figure out simple operational expense equipment leasing let alone the actual technology they supposedly manage, so to save their bacon they fire everyone and bring in the smart people to buffer them, like bricabrac said, or hire overpriced consultants like me who have all working experience and no formal education but can get the job done.

But my problem is nobody ever makes it past my interviews. I simply find more and more people lying or really stretching the truth to fit into a role they can't do.
But it helps at my company we have a simple spreadsheet that helps hiring the right people. i will clean it out of my company names and stuff if you want a copy.

[dcan]

But I my problem is nobody ever makes it past my interviews. I simply find more and more people lying or really stretching the truth to fit into a role they can't do. At my company we have a spreadsheet that helps hiring the right people. i will clean it out of my company names and stuff if you want a copy.

I would actually like to see this, if you don't mind.

[mrs.b]

So true!! I actually give those who have the game face and use the current buzz words the thumbs down. I prefer candidates who have be to drawn out.

This! Reference checking helps, but personal references are pretty much pointless. Some professional references are "doctored" as well. I typically prefer to call only managerial references, and instead of calling provided numbers, I like to call the general switchboard for the companies and ask to be transferred to ensure I get the real one. (More than a few people have their buddy play Mr. Boss.)

If interviewing with the position in mind, it goes better, at least. If the position needs the sort of person that will keep their head down and do their job without fuss, someone that listens more than talks is probably the better fit. The person that talks a good game and nearly runs the meeting for you will either be more interested in taking your job than doing theirs, or is just talking with nothing behind it.

Basically, there's no fool-proofed way to make sure the person selected is going to be the right one. I've lost count of the number of times I've wished I could do what House (television show, for those not familiar) did when he lost his first team. If I could bring in all applicants, put them all to work, and see which ones can back up the talk and which ones just know how to write a resume and give an interview, I'd love it. Unfortunately, corporate office hasn't approved that budget yet.

[scorched]

Here is the interview scoring spreadsheet.

Its pretty simple in nature, you pre-fill in the left side for topics and descriptions you think are important. It already has a scoring mechanism associated to it with a range of 1-20 for most topics.. This allows us to interview alot of candidates and have a wide range of scores, instead of worrying about small ranges of 1-5 then you have to make a tie breaker somehow.

So as the interview goes along you take notes and fill it in later or as your talking if phone interview. Out of the 100 possible points nobody has ever made it past 71 with me, but if the rest of the team has a high rating they have a chance.

Each interviewer gets a individual copy of this spreadsheet and sends it to the hiring manager after the interview, the hiring manager then consolidates all the scores into one spreadsheet to see how they rank from an overall perspective. The winners and losers become quite obvious. The reason for each interviewer getting an initial separate copy is to avoid biased interviews.

cheers!

Note to the admins.. you really need to go into the vbulletin admin panel under attachments > attachment manager and add xlsx type of excel spreadsheets.

[burbuja0512]

@Clep101 - you're hired! Ha ha - do you really want to be in sales? Here's the job description: I'll give you a product and a sales goal. So, you'll sell the widgets and then you bring in 500k of new business by the end of the year or you're fired. lol.. ok it's a little better than that, but not much. I don't know why I stay in sales other than I really like meeting new people and I'm good at public speaking. Other than that, it's not that great. Of course, you're out there in the heat and danger fighting for us so I should NOT even complain!!

@hmuchmo - I TOTALLY agree about the sense of entitlement. I've posted on the forum before about my worst interview ever. An intelligent, well-spoken college student who had a decent resume for her age, but I still couldn't figure out why she was applying for a sales job. I asked her where she saw her career in five years. The answer: "Well, once I finish my MBA, I'll be in executive management." Ummmm yeah.. It seriously took all I had not to just end the interview right there. If it were that easy to get into executive mgmt, why would anyone be wasting their time working their way up? Thx for posting the spreadsheet too.

@Mrs. B - I love your ideas on how to check "real" references. I have always wondered why people even bother to provide references anymore.. after all, who doesn't have a friend that would pose as a boss or former colleague to provide a reference.

@bricabrac *sigh* so true.. I hadn't thought about it in a while but yes, every time I've seen a very senior exec get hired, all of the sudden, within a month or two, I see a bunch of people that are hired on that used to work with this exec at their last company. The term I've always used is "toadies" Is that even a real word? I don't know, but I would say something like "be careful what you say to Bob. He's the new EVP's toadie and they've worked together for 15 years." lol gotta love the corporate world.